supplements

[kapazi]

can anyone help me out with advice to supplements designed for fighters not wanting to put on much weight but want to cut up in the mean time!!

[WD40]

My experience is they don't work. It's all marketing and hype.

You should be able to get all the nutrients, vitamins, and minerals you need through a proper eating plan.

[humble]

Wow, every time this topic comes up, some know it all either claims zero effectiveness or another know it all claims the absolute bees knees.

Truth is always in the middle.

Please use the search function for countless other threads on this topic.

[Jon]

rapid cuts "hardcore". don't know if any fighters use it but heard its pretty good for striping body fat and maintaining strength

[Dynamite Drew]

why do it with chemicals ?
cant be good in the long run

whats wrong with good old fashioned hard training and a decent diet ?

too lazy and/or impatient ?

[kapazi]

those days are gone! you cant honestly say the the top fighters here in OZ are not taking any type of supplements!

[WD40]

That's right, the best Thai fighters in the world past and present have been taking supplements for centuries!

[brave]

Ive seen a pick of buakaw at home with a tub of protein.

Thais live and breath MT from birth. Its there job. Most fighters in oz have a full time job which isnt MT.

[RAKY]

There is nothing wrong with SUSTAGEN SPORT. I remember a few years ago boxing i went from 80 to 71 in 3 weeks and it tastes good to.The ais use it so it must be good and is fairly cheap to.Ill def get back on it real soon.

[kingwaa]

im not going to rave on about this again.
but ill give you a few supps to research

pure l-arginine
beta-alanine
hmb
protein
coenzyme q10
rezveretrol

do some research on those and you will be amased at the effeciveness

if you want any of these supplements give me a buzz a bodizone in lutwyche queensland if you want any of these or anything else

[Phreak]

Best people to ask are the muzza's at the summer days new years dance party

[DazMon]

Anyone know where I can get Body Well E2 Voltage?
Kingy?

[Rocky]

quote:Originally posted by humble

Wow, every time this topic comes up, some know it all either claims zero effectiveness or another know it all claims the absolute bees knees.

Truth is always in the middle.

Please use the search function for countless other threads on this topic.





Truth is always in the middle?

Supplements - have no long term effect.

As opposed to short term, the effort required to take them ;)

[Rocky]

quote:Originally posted by kingwaa

im not going to rave on about this again.
but ill give you a few supps to research

pure l-arginine
beta-alanine
hmb
protein
coenzyme q10
rezveretrol

do some research on those and you will be amased at the effeciveness

if you want any of these supplements give me a buzz a bodizone in lutwyche queensland if you want any of these or anything else


research on those products will promise you a phyqiue like Ronnie Coleman without taking a ml of gear.

Total bll****.


SIMPLE FORMULA without Spending 1 cent on crap
Ways to keep fit/add muscle etc:

- Eat Perfectly Clean and REgular
- Train Hard
- some cardio will help (increase if neccessary)

and change things up.

[kingwaa]

quote:research on those products will promise you a phyqiue like Ronnie Coleman without taking a ml of gear

hmmm did you do any research rocky. none of those products are actually ment to put on size. majority of them are for recovery, energy. good to see you know your stuff.

dazmon sorry i dont mate. ill see what i can find out for you tho

[Hironaka]

quote:Originally posted by kingwaa

im not going to rave on about this again.
but ill give you a few supps to research

pure l-arginine
beta-alanine


I am hearing more and more about these, but do not have the time to research properly at the moment.

In a nutshell, key benefits and any known side-effects?

[Rocky]

quote:Originally posted by kingwaa

quote:research on those products will promise you a phyqiue like Ronnie Coleman without taking a ml of gear

hmmm did you do any research rocky. none of those products are actually ment to put on size. majority of them are for recovery, energy. good to see you know your stuff.

dazmon sorry i dont mate. ill see what i can find out for you tho


Research doest not come from the net or product information. It comes from either

A. Listen to others who have wasted there money
B. be the guinea pig

[witt]

quote:Originally posted by Hironaka

quote:Originally posted by kingwaa

im not going to rave on about this again.
but ill give you a few supps to research

pure l-arginine
beta-alanine


I am hearing more and more about these, but do not have the time to research properly at the moment.

In a nutshell, key benefits and any known side-effects?


Takes less than 15 minutes to research, don't be lazy.

Key benefits:

quote:Originally posted by kingwaa
recovery, energy

[Rocky]

Recovery = REST. Supplements wont do more than REST.

Which costs u FK ALL.

[witt]

quote:Originally posted by Rocky

Recovery = REST. Supplements wont do more than REST.

Which costs u FK ALL.


They're called supplements because they supplement your rest, not replace it...

[humble]

quote:Originally posted by Rocky

Recovery = REST. Supplements wont do more than REST.

Which costs u FK ALL.


lol.

So I take it glucose, electrolytes, antioxidants, protein, amino acids and so on all magically appear in your blood stream if you just rest?

[hunter01]

my only issue king wa is who is writing the research. Did you know that smoking reduced chances of get parkinsons? I have also worked with a photographer who claims to have taken the "before and after" model shots (on side of tub) on the same day. I'm not a fan but jmo

[LOWKICK87]

ey guys, wat about glucosamine pills? any side effects?

[dreamer]

i been using 'hydroxy ripped' protein powder. first one ive ever used and its helped me put bit of muscle mass and rip up but havnt put on much weight so its perfect for me. dunno what other ppl think of it but few guys i train with us it to. im only a 63.5kg fighter tho.

[lenny888]

lmao humble

i would say a multi vitamin, omega 3 fish oil, whey protein and perhaps creatine? that and a good diet

[Mordan31]

quote:Originally posted by kingwaa

im not going to rave on about this again.
but ill give you a few supps to research

pure l-arginine
beta-alanine
hmb
protein
coenzyme q10
rezveretrol

do some research on those and you will be amased at the effeciveness

if you want any of these supplements give me a buzz a bodizone in lutwyche queensland if you want any of these or anything else


Kingwaa I have to agree mate been using argnine for years for after training and recovery, if can't find it in powder I take in from popcorn One of the bests aminos I reckon with hardly and publicity.

[ScottL]

I've taken different supplements that have been reccomended to me for years alot don't do a great deal. The ones i've had the best results from though are AAKG (arginine alpha keto glutarate), HMB, Glutamine and Kre-alkylin (buffered creatine with neutral ph). I can't live without my glutamine though. Hands down best recovery supp i've used. Everyone will have different results though.

[Rocky]

Eat well (you know what i mean here) and you can throw all that sh it away. Why pay more than you have to?

(of course this is conditional if you are taking gear).

[Rocky]

quote:Originally posted by lenny888

lmao humble

i would say a multi vitamin, omega 3 fish oil, whey protein and perhaps creatine? that and a good diet


Not supplements, thats part of every day food. Eat well. dont waste $$.

[Rocky]

quote:Originally posted by humble

quote:Originally posted by Rocky

Recovery = REST. Supplements wont do more than REST.

Which costs u FK ALL.


lol.

So I take it glucose, electrolytes, antioxidants, protein, amino acids and so on all magically appear in your blood stream if you just rest?


Buddy.. a well rounded diet has all this PLUS more.

If your gunna be lazy and not eat well, then are you really that serious about looking/feeling great? Answer is NO.

DOnt expect anything if it aint for the long haul.

[Ron Burgandy]

Ron here...In a perfect world eating "strict" is as you say Rocky...no need for supps. Lets think about caffeine as a supplement. When you are just about to workout, weights or pads and you feel you need a hit of something...do you just take a deep breath and go "yep thats all I needed as I dont need to take supps" Hmmm I dont think so. you have a coffee or take some no-xplode or superpump or re-activate to get you up. Something that is classed as a supplement to give you that little hit when you need it the most.
We are all lazy at some point in your life with diet...if your cutting weight do you not run with a sweat suit on cos its a un-natural method...lets face it....supps are out there cos they work and they are marketed really well. Some work well for some ppl and others work for others...everyone is different.
After a big weights session and your running out of time...do you grab that chicken breast, veges and rice or do you grab the protein shake for convienience?? Digestion plays a massive part also so if we are talking about effectiveness of a powder vs a solid food then the powder will digest more rapidly then the solid chicken breast. So Rocky would you go for the 6 meals of chicken, steak, veges, rice ect or 3-4 meals of that SUPPLEMENTED with 2 protein shakes with water that gives you 30g of protein?? Do you trust the nutritional value of the chicken or steak or something that you know has 30g per serve?

No brainer in my honest opinion.

[Hironaka]

quote:Originally posted by Ron Burgandy

Do you trust the nutritional value of the chicken or steak or something that you know has 30g per serve?


This is something that we discussed in chemistry last week. When ANY food is cook, the nutritional value will change significantly from what is quoted on the package. The amount of change is decided upon a combination of factors, including method of cooking, how long it is cooked for etc.

It is literally impossible to work out the nutritional value of ANY food, including meat and vegetables, once they are cooked. Unless you have a lab in your house that allows you to conduct the tests independently. But by that stage, your food will be cold anyway and need to be thrown out. Then you get a pizza.

[kingwaa]

ron you hit the nail on the head.
yes supplements do cost money. but lets say i but a 3kg tub of max's reloaded hgf, cost me $209. i get 100 serves out of that tub. so each shake is costing me $2.09. where if i was to have a steak or chicken, how much is that going to cost?????? say if i but the cheapest steak at $4. lets time that by 100 serves = $400. so which is cheaper rocky??????

also does whey protein isolate take more or less time to digest then a steak???????

also if this is not 2 of the biggest contridictions from the one person i dont know what is

quote:
research on those products will promise you a phyqiue like Ronnie Coleman without taking a ml of gear.

Total bll****.

quote:Research doest not come from the net or product information. It comes from either

A. Listen to others who have wasted there money
B. be the guinea pig


and also did ppl know that in 94 (ish) scientist won a nobel price for the research into the effectivness of arginine
argine is actually one of the main ingridients in viagra and cialis.
so if its in priscription medicine to increase blood flow, one would assume it works

[Rocky]

Show me pictures of someone before/after :)

Proof is in practicality. You will get no visible gains, long term, by simply RELYING supplements.

Supplements like EVERY SINGLE one you have mentioned are found in foods.

By the time these protein companies r ape the WPI into that powder form, doubt its any good/beneficial (ever read up on clinical trials on the impact of powerderised protein? stress on kidneys?).

Take a read, for example, the ASN Protein shakes. Promises that they will give you 10,000 dollars if you can gain x amount of muscle etc etc.


Eat well or take roids.
Oh and train hard too :)

[Octagon]

two types of suppliment taking people.. people who put in the hard work and get results. they take suppliments which may or may not give them a bit of an edge/benefit. and people who don't work as hard as they could. they take suppliments for an easier solution and get next to zero benefit.

in my experience people who ask about suppliments and take all the latest stuff dont have the right attitude about training and hard work..

[Rocky]

quote:Originally posted by Octagon

two types of suppliment taking people.. people who put in the hard work and get results. they take suppliments which may or may not give them a bit of an edge/benefit. and people who don't work as hard as they could. they take suppliments for an easier solution and get next to zero benefit.

in my experience people who ask about suppliments and take all the latest stuff dont have the right attitude about training and hard work..


Totally agreed.

[ricku]

I normally wouldn't comment but just some food for thought from my personal experience. I train 5 days per weeks Muay Thai and Weights, I eat well, heaps of fruit vegies, fish, chicken, etc. One of my clients is a Naturopath so he convinced me to see him around 2 years ago to check out my blood and see what my internal health was like. From looking at my blood I found that I was highly protein deficient plus some other problems due to over training and under nutrition, however I felt fit and had alot of energy and good strength. I have increased my protein intake through whey protein to around 50 to 100 grams per day. Some of the other supplements he recommended I have stopped taking as they just are too expensive with no measurable results internally or externally but my point is if you are putting your body through rigorous exercise you don't really know what is happening inside and what your body needs to recover faster and you need more than what your body can naturally produce and when you actually take a look inside at what is happening, then you get the real picture. I think there is a middle ground between eating well, training hard, resting (at least 1-2 days per week) plus for boxing and weights, definitely need to add in some protein and pay the money for a high quality product as the cheap ones do not get absorbed. Look at all the top althletes in any sport, they all take some kind of supplement to assist in recovery. Anyway, just sharing my experience so not saying anyone is wrong or right, just sharing.